BLM UK is an abomination.

[djm]

I did say I would put forwards some thoughts on this vile racist movement.

As mentioned in the 'critical race BS thread' having grown up in a slum I do not feel any any need top apologise for any 'white privilege'.

I know little and care even less about American race relations, but have to admit I am somewhat perplexed over the outcry over George Floyd. Yes the policing was substandard, but 1. There is no evidence it is race related. and 2. He was a disgusting person that I find it very hard to care about.

Seeing my own country attacked by leftist protests I am unimpressed. My nation has done more to combat racism than any in history. It did more to rid the world of slavery than any in history. Working class white people in the UK benefitted not one jot from slavery and have nothing to apologise for. Indeed it is the condition of the working classes in Northern England that led to Marx and Engels writing the Communist Party Manifesto!

There has never existed a less racist nation than mine. George Floyd is irrelevant here.

[Julius_Van_Der_Beak]

. My nation has done more to combat racism than any in history

Yup. The UK textile mills that fueled the Industrial Revolution and the British Empire absolutely did not profit off of cotton made by American slaves.

While we're at it, the British Empire was a totally benevolent, anti-racist institution that spread feminism everywhere and there is absolutely nothing racist about the English form of colonialism. It also totally did not contribute to world conflict in any way, shape, or form, especially not conflicts that might still be ongoing.

/sarcasm off

[djm]

. My nation has done more to combat racism than any in history

Yup. The UK textile mills that fueled the Industrial Revolution and the British Empire absolutely did not profit off of cotton made by American slaves.

Those textile mills were staffed by children as young as six years old losing limbs working in machines. The staff were payed in mill scrip redeemable only at the mill shop. Yeah my people coined it in off the back of slavery.

The reality is that some rich white people and some rich black people exploited lots of poor white and poor black people. There were as many black people involved in the slave trade as white. Slavery is evil. Most white people had fuck all to do with it.

[Julius_Van_Der_Beak]

. My nation has done more to combat racism than any in history

Yup. The UK textile mills that fueled the Industrial Revolution and the British Empire absolutely did not profit off of cotton made by American slaves.

Those textile mills were staffed by children as young as six years old losing limbs working in machines. The staff were payed in mill scrip redeemable only at the mill shop. Yeah my people coined it in off the back of slavery.

The reality is that some rich white people and some rich black people exploited lots of poor white and poor black people. There were as many black people involved in the slave trade as white. Slavery is evil. Most white people had fuck all to do with it.

I'm more annoyed than anyone by the exclusion of class issues from mainstream liberal American politics. But I don't think that means we need to pretend that racism doesn't exist or that cops don't have a habit of shooting unarmed people, usually (but not always) those who happen to be black and brown.

Anway, elsewhere on this forum, you express views that are pretty much identical to the ones held by people who consider capitalism the best system we can ever have. For instance, you are unwilling to consider the idea that billionaires might not deserve all their wealth. Care to explain how that matches with your position on class?

I'm not 100% sure that I agree with the statement that we shouldn't have billionaires, but I will say that billionaires as they currently exist are usually pretty fucking terrible and tend to spend at least a portion of their wealth bribing politicians so that they can make even more money and stop or stall efforts at actually making things better for everyone. I'm certainly not going tot defend "job creators" as people people who "truly contribute" to society who are unfairly maligned by "losers", especially because they always ask for government handouts they're against for everyone else when the economy goes south.

[djm]

I'm more annoyed than anyone by the exclusion of class issues from mainstream liberal American politics. But I don't think that means we need to pretend that racism doesn't exist or that cops don't have a habit of shooting unarmed people, usually (but not always) those who happen to be black and brown.

Anway, elsewhere on this forum, you express views that are pretty much identical to the ones held by people who consider capitalism the best system we can ever have. For instance, you are unwilling to consider the idea that billionaires might not deserve all their wealth. Care to explain how that matches with your position on class?

I'm not 100% sure that I agree with the statement that we shouldn't have billionaires, but I will say that billionaires as they currently exist are usually pretty fucking terrible and tend to spend at least a portion of their wealth bribing politicians so that they can make even more money and stop or still efforts at actually making things better for everyone. I'm certainly not going tot defend "job creators" as people people who "truly contribute" to society who are unfairly maligned by "losers", especially because they always ask for government handouts they're against for everyone else when the economy goes south.

Check the thread title Einstein. I am not American. The British police are too busy ignoring mass rape of poor white kids to shoot brown people. Our police and systems are not racist. I do not appreciate thugs vandalising war memorials and statues of Churchill and Gandhi. The ignorance of these people is beyond belief. My Russian immigrant ex serf great grandfather is commemorated by the war memorial these wankers are defacing.

Capitalism has pulled more people out of poverty than any other system in history. Communism has murdered more people than any other system in history. I don't care much for either and would do well in either, but for the benefit of humanity it is the easiest choice ever.

As for the British Empire, my folk derived about as much benefit from it as George Floyd has. My country has contributed much to the world, I love it dearly and will not tolerate race baiting shite from America seeding unjustified discord.

[Julius_Van_Der_Beak]

Check the thread title Einstein. I am not American.

You still had the good sense to weigh in on American politics and call George Floyd a disgusting person, though. To me the issue doesn't seem to be confined to the idea that people are protesting in the UK (and I suspect they have valid reasons, although not having ever been there, it's like an exoplanet that I can't observe directly and have to deduce from other organizations*), and the fact that you seem to think the BLM cause is bogus in the US as well.

* I think the issue a lot of British folks I've encountered on the internet have with things like BLM in the U.S. convinces me that racism probably exists on some level in the U.K.

I know little and care even less about American race relations, but have to admit I am somewhat perplexed over the outcry over George Floyd. Yes the policing was substandard, but 1. There is no evidence it is race related. and 2. He was a disgusting person that I find it very hard to care about.

Capitalism has pulled more people out of poverty than any other system in history. Communism has murdered more people than any other system in history. I don't care much for either and would do well in either, but for the benefit of humanity it is the easiest choice ever.

To me the issue sounds less like you are upset that people aren't talking about poor white people, and more that you're just not a big fan of change because everything is just fine. I don't see what the point of bringing up poor white people is, because it's not something you really seem to care that much about since we have such a great system for getting them out of poverty.

I've heard a lot of people making unexamined and unsupported assertions that capitalism maximises efficiency. I don't see a great deal of evidence for this claim. The last year is a pretty illustrative example. Part of what I've been told for why the USSR was such a terrible system was that there were shortages and that you couldn't get basic goods, which was why it collapsed. I experienced all of that in the U.S. over the past year. I've also read stories of, while this is happening, food rotting in fields because the maximum efficiency of the invisible hand of the market apparently can't figure out how to get that into stores and restaurants. I think the idea that "the market can fix everything" (which is not necessarily a claim you made, but I associate it with statements like "capitalism pulls people out of poverty") is something that we've all seen is obvious bullshit in the past year, and I think it's more apparent to more people than ever.

[djm]

You still had the good sense to weigh in on American politics and call George Floyd a disgusting person, though.
[/quote]

On what planet is a scumbag career criminal with his history not a scumbag. The police were wrong to do what they did. Both are true.

Riots in my country are not justified by this.

[Julius_Van_Der_Beak]

On what planet is a scumbag career criminal with his history not a scumbag. The police were wrong to do what they did. Both are true.

Because racism doesn't exist there even though lots of British people feel a strange need to call George Floyd a scumbag?

[Julius_Van_Der_Beak]

Aren't courts of law are supposed to be for deciding what to do with career criminals, and we're not just supposed to randomly execute people if we think they might be a criminal, even if they are?

I must be missing something here.

[djm]

On what planet is a scumbag career criminal with his history not a scumbag. The police were wrong to do what they did. Both are true.

Because racism doesn't exist there even though lots of British people feel a strange need to call George Floyd a scumbag?

George Floyd was a scumbag because of his actions. Hitler was a scumbag because of his actions. Not all American black people are scumbags. Not all White Germans are scumbags. The policeman that killed George Floyd was a scumbag his behaviour was not acceptable. This stuff is nit rocket science. Most normal working class folk of all shades can call out scumbags of all shades.